A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

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sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Sat Mar 07, 2015 10:20 am

OK, it has been about three months, but no, I wasn't procrastinating I was researching. :D

I am writing with tears in my eyes, not because I'm so emotional about getting back to the project, but because I moved a seemingly half ton lathe myself away from the panel boxes and my back is screaming about it. It was a code violation I'd been wanting to correct for some time.

I did find a great video of a hidden door as Teken mentioned:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jw6VEyQTtU
It is such high quality I was wondering if it was Teken's house? :D But I'm going to try to have something in the corner there to somehow hide the wiring, but I still need to be able to open a door because the irrigation control is in that corner too.

I have actually put on the CTs for the Subpanel #1, and I'll take a photo at some point. What I found though is that I'm mighty happy I ordered the Split-60 CTs, which can be installed without removing the stranded wiring. I've installed the CT40s on the solid wire circuits, which from loosening the wires from the breakers there must have been two different electricians wiring it, one with crushing strength. I've been trying to get the torque correct when I've reinstalled them, as the proper value is printed on the breaker. Not having to worry about the stranded wires torque has been a huge help.

Now, I'm not sure it is required code, but Teken has suggested and most others I think have done it this way, I'm needing to run the CT wires through conduit to the corner where I'm putting the GEM. I've somewhat decided that even though it is a bit more conduit, I'm going to run each side from the panel separately, so that at least from the main panel and subpanel #1 I'll have four small conduit runs, instead of one or two larger conduit runs. That way I can keep the wiring a bit more organized. I'm still trying to decide between the flex conduit and the PVC conduit.
Last edited by sub3marathonman on Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Teken
Posts: 2700
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:09 pm
Location: The Bad Lands

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by Teken » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:30 am

sub3marathonman wrote:OK, it has been about three months, but no, I wasn't procrastinating I was researching. :D

I am writing with tears in my eyes, not because I'm so emotional about getting back to the project, but because I moved a seemingly half ton lathe myself away from the panel boxes and my back is screaming about it. It was a code violation I'd been wanting to correct for some time.

I did find a great video of a hidden door as Teken mentioned:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jw6VEyQTtU
It is such high quality I was wondering if it was Teken's house? :D But I'm going to try to have something in the corner there to somehow hide the wiring, but I still need to be able to open a door because the irrigation control is in that corner too.

I have actually put on the CTs for the Panel #1, and I'll take a photo at some point. What I found though is that I'm mighty happy I ordered the Split-60 CTs, which can be installed without removing the stranded wiring. I've installed the CT40s on the solid wire circuits, which from loosening the wires from the breakers there must have been two different electricians wiring it, one with crushing strength. I've been trying to get the torque correct when I've reinstalled them, as the proper value is printed on the breaker. Not having to worry about the stranded wires torque has been a huge help.

Now, I'm not sure it is required code, but Teken has suggested and most others I think have done it this way, I'm needing to run the CT wires through conduit to the corner where I'm putting the GEM. I've somewhat decided that even though it is a bit more conduit, I'm going to run each side from the panel separately, so that at least from the main panel and panel #1 I'll have four small conduit runs, instead of one or two larger conduit runs. That way I can keep the wiring a bit more organized. I'm still trying to decide between the flex conduit and the PVC conduit.
Ouch I feel your pain last year I was moving a car which had sat for probably 3 years on dolly's. Low and behold the wheels were rusted and seized! :| I must have pushed on that vehicle for about two hours until I got it to its final resting place!

I thought my heart was going to explode! :shock:

The NEC / CEC will dictate whether or not the cable requires being encased in conduit or not. I did not have to because its not code here and plus its not flush mounted. Since the entire wall is on a panel board and affixed with the proper termination staples, mounts, etc it met code by default.

The use of the push and slide hidden panel door assembly again needs to be referenced to your local NEC / CEC codes. As you noted you can not have anything obstructing the panel directly below the service panel. I am completely guilty of this right this moment as I have a large portable table holding my servers and other electronic components which I do testing on.

The reality is no one is coming into my home to perform an inspection and access is still present regardless of the table sitting below it. I will have to move it once all of my basement reno's are done but until then its going to sit there until I make room because the table saw, miter saw, drill press, are all in this room at the moment! :mrgreen:

I am looking forward to seeing more photo's and progress of your project! Sometime this year my plans are to relocate a few devices on this massive wall and place items in larger enclosures to help clean up the visuals and the grouping of security sub systems etc.
Teken . . .

My ongoing projects thread: http://www.brultech.com/community/viewt ... ?f=2&t=929
Buy me a cup of coffee: https://www.paypal.me/Teken https://gfinotify.com/ Discount Code: PC10
sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:13 am

OK, it took a couple of weeks, but I think I can actually move again! And I'll probably wait another day or two before attempting to drag/push/pull that lathe into its proper place. :roll:

So, there has been actual progress with installing the GEM!!

I have installed it on the garage wall. :D
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(Note: The conduit visible is for the PV wiring from the inverter to the electrical panels.)


That turned out to be a bit more of a project than I at first thought. My initial idea was to attach a board on the concrete wall with concrete screws, then attach the GEM to that. And it went perfectly, with the GEM precision mounted to be straight. Then I started thinking ... , which isn't good. :? I looked at the GEM website, http://www.greeneyemonitor.com/ after I was finished. It showed the beautiful installation of the wiring from behind the GEM.
Brultech Rear Cable Entry 295px.png
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I thought, OK, I'll just drill a bit out of the board, so they can enter from behind. Well, where it was put wouldn't allow any drilling from either side, so I decided to put another board on, which was actually two cross boards, leaving an area in the middle open. Once again I put the GEM up perfectly aligned, only to discover that I just missed being able to have the areas on the back of the GEM completely open. So I'm not sure if it will be alright, or if I'll drill out the cross boards a bit for the wiring.

Now, I've also made progress with the CT installation!!!

I've gotten Subpanel #1 almost completed. I actually have all the circuits with a CT in place, and I've gotten them routed out through the bottom of the panel. I decided it would be neater to exit each side separately, so I put the little 1/2" threaded fitting in, a conduit locknut, and the bushing on the top to protect the wiring.
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One bit of interesting procedure was knocking out the little tabs in the bottom. It seems that somebody somewhere has made a special tool for doing this without hurting the drywall. It really was nothing more than a bent screwdriver. Since I didn't want to wreck a screwdriver, I grabbed a little allen wrench which is L-shaped, worked it under the panel where the drywall met it, and gently pushed up a few times to get it started, then I used a regular screwdriver from above to finish working the little round tab back and forth until it came out.

The other challenge was getting the threaded connector to the panel without cutting the drywall. So with a hole in the drywall for where an outlet will be, I worked with a wire through the bottom hole and over to the drywall hole, then hooked the connector to the wire and gently pulled until it was to the hole and I could work a few threads inside. Then I put the locknut on and got it secured.

Now, I thought I was really smart :lol: , I put in not one but two extra CT40s into the box. Well, that was great, but now, after looking further into how the GEM is set up, you can't mix CT40s and CT80s on the same line, even though they are the same type of CT.

(If you look at Teken's project, Page 1, about 80% of the way down it shows the Green Eye Monitor setup where you've got to choose which CT is for that channel.)


So what I should have done was put an extra CT40 and a CT80 in there. I'm not sure if I'll do the bit of extra work to get that CT80 in there, as I'm thinking I'll have to run it out with the main panel CT leads now.

One other coincidence I'm now wondering about is with the refrigerator circuit. I made sure the refrigerator wasn't running when I turned off the breakers and disconnected the wiring. There was seemingly no problem, the CT was on, the wring reconnected, and the breaker restored to "on." But, two or three days later it seemed something was wrong and the ice maker wasn't working and the freezer wasn't as cold. So once again, I turned the breaker off, and pulled the refrigerator out (which is a job too), cleaned it thoroughly, and reinstalled it. By good fortune, knocking on wood right now, the refrigerator seems to have resumed normal functioning. But, I just wonder if I might not have decided to use one of the Split60s on it, as I understand that refrigerators are extremely touchy about power outages.
Last edited by sub3marathonman on Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:38 am

Here is the Subpanel #1 Before:
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Here is the Subpanel #1 After CT installation:
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sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:42 pm

There has actually been more progress!!!

I have finished installing and running the CT leads from the main panel.
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Now, if you notice in the lower right hand corner, there is a small bit of damage to the drywall. That is where I was trying to use the allen wrench to get the tab started, and it absolutely would not budge. I ended up drilling into it, then twisting it to get it started, and then knocking it out. So that part didn't go the best, and there is a small amount of damage that remains visible even after installing the panel cover. So at some point I'll have to fix that.

I've gotten the conduit installed and the CT wires run through for Subpanel #1, and they came out right by the GEM. I also got the Power Brick and the PT Brick into the OnQ panel there, and actually had already drilled the two holes there previously to be able to have access to the two outlets inside the panel, but it still doesn't look 100% professional. The GEM is actually powered up now!!! :D I've even got it set for the network to access it. I don't know if there really ends up being any difference, but I used the static IP address method.

One thing that I did notice though, upon entering the setup program for the GEM, is that mine has an extremely low serial number (less than 50). I'm just wondering if that indicates it is an old but never used item, as it is for the wi-fi only. I don't know if I should be concerned even if it is a bit old, I don't know if there is a manufacture date on the main GEM board that I can look at.
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But, as far as looking professional, I'm afraid my conduit run for the Main Panel will end up looking "Rube Goldbergish" as those leads have to be extended, and I'm trying to not cut any leads before putting them on the terminal blocks that I'm using (idea credit to Teken who used them too, and Tirnanah, who showed the idea first back in 2012).
sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Wed May 13, 2015 11:37 am

I have made a bit more progress, I just haven't organized the photos to post here.

But I'm running into a bit of a conundrum. I'm having to combine several circuits to be monitored on the same channel, and I'm wondering what I should do about monitoring the kitchen lights. I can group them in with the dishwasher/disposal and have everything that happens in the kitchen monitored, but really kitchen lights have nothing in common with running the dishwasher.

Or I can group them into lighting, but then I'm combining the garage and outdoor lights, which once again really aren't connected in any way with monitoring the kitchen lights.

I thought at some point after things are set up, it was possible to tell the individual circuit even within a group of monitored circuits by the usage, but can a program break this data out for a "virtual monitored circuit?"

I thought I'd be able to avoid combining unrelated circuits, 32 seems like a huge number until I started trying to figure out where 50 or 60 circuits should go.

Thanks for the suggestions.
tnakelski
Posts: 74
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 1:27 pm

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by tnakelski » Thu May 14, 2015 7:04 am

I too had more circuits then the GEM's 32, what I did was combined some unlike circuits, ones that are infrequently used with ones that are used often. One example was combining the bathroom Jacuzzi tub (rarely if ever used) with the instant hot water dispenser in the kitchen which is used often. I also combined the kitchen counter outlets with the dining room outlets for the same reason, dining room outlets low usage, kitchen outlets frequently used. It makes it easier to see the power usage when the low use circuits are drawing power especially on devices that have a constant wattage draw like the bathroom Jacuzzi tub. As you get the GEM up and running, and overtime you will start to understand your power usage and what each device in your home is drawing.
Teken
Posts: 2700
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:09 pm
Location: The Bad Lands

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by Teken » Thu May 14, 2015 9:09 am

This highlights the key reason for monitoring both sides of the electrical feed too. This way you can still monitor the over all energy consumption of the home. While using SEG / DB you can simply subtract that energy from the mains.

I created a thread about extending the total amount of channels the GEM could support. Lend your voice to that product feature request so Brultech can see there is still a need for expansion.

48 monitored circuits would be the best balance of needs vs wants for most. Looking forward to more install photo's.
Teken . . .

My ongoing projects thread: http://www.brultech.com/community/viewt ... ?f=2&t=929
Buy me a cup of coffee: https://www.paypal.me/Teken https://gfinotify.com/ Discount Code: PC10
sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:14 pm

sub3marathonman wrote:OK, it has been about three months, but no, I wasn't procrastinating I was researching. :D
OK, now it has been almost nine months, but yes, this time I was procrastinating. :oops:

I had debated about how to run the wiring from Subpanel #2 to the GEM. In the end, I ended up doing it as I had at first thought, but with a bit of inspiration from Sears when I got a good deal on their Gladiator GearTrack garage organization wall mount channel. I plan on installing it to cover the exit hole in the wall.

These pictures should be better than my words:
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and a closer view:
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The white shelf bracket was removed. I had at one point hoped to run the wires around the bracket, but the Gladiator option seems neater and more professional. I also put a piece of conduit as a press-fit into the hole in the drywall for the CT wires to come through. I then pressed it flush to the drywall.

The same procedure for getting the wires out of the panel, knockout one of the little tabs, then run the CT wires to the bottom and out, then through the conduit and out.
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sub3marathonman
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:32 am

Re: A Journey To GEM / My Big Project

Post by sub3marathonman » Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:22 pm

Next will be attaching the CT leads to the four terminal blocks I installed on the garage wall. Using the terminal blocks was a huge help, as Teken had done (halfway down page 1 "My GEM Install"). I'll have to look up which ones I ended up ordering, as they were slightly higher rated than those.
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A view of the four terminal blocks (I staggered them to make it a bit easier for attaching the wires, instead of having every wire on top of each other):
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Then I gathered the excess lengths of wire and fed them back into Subpanel #2, which I will show in the next posting.
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